From Champions MUSH

Angst tells me this is our preferred way of proposing stuff, so here I am with a houserules proposal for discussion.

Background: The basic goal here is to allow a CM version of an on-the-fly impersonation Multiform that gets around the CM rule about having all multiform sheets be fully specified and approved before use, while still preventing abuse. I'm proposing it because I'd like Dancing Coyote v5 to buy it, natch.

Contents 1 Proposed House Rule: Impersonation Multiform 1.1 PERSONALITY LOSS 1.2 IMPERSONATION AMNESIA 1.3 SUBMERGING PERSONALITIES 1.4 “BUILDING” THE TARGET SHEET 1.5 PARTIAL IMPERSONATION 1.6 Comments: Anastrophe 1.7 Response to Anastrophe 1.8 Mental Illusions version 2 Proposed House Rule: Concentration and Movement Powers

Proposed House Rule: Impersonation Multiform

At GM discretion, a character may buy a +10 Adder on Multiform: “Impersonate Target”.

When you use Impersonate, you define the target. It can differ from use to use. The target itself is not affected in any way; it might not even be aware of the impersonation… however, it must be nearby when Impersonate is used.

You can purchase Impersonate at any level, using normal Multiform rules. However, if your target is built on more points than the level at which you buy the Impersonate, the Impersonate simply fails. (At GM discretion, you may be allowed a “partial impersonation” – see below for more details.)

When using Impersonate you pick up not only the target’s appearance but also its essence. This has certain disadvantages:

• You get all the Disads your target has.
• The target’s personality may overwhelm your own. (see Personality Loss, below).

On the other hand, it has certain advantages:

• You generally act, look, and sound like the target without need for Acting, Disguise, Mimicry, Shapeshift, etc. This affects all senses. It’s not an illusion – you really are the target, sorta.
• You know things that the target knows. That means you know the combination to their home safe, the pet names they call their wives, where they went to high school, etc. However, when you return to your true form you will forget all of that information (see Impersonation Amnesia, below).
• You can “submerge” your own personality under your target’s to avoid detection. (See Submerging Personalities, below)

PERSONALITY LOSS

Impersonate always has a special version of Personality Loss, for which you get no point-cost reduction. This is not based on time, but certain events may cause you to lose control, as described elsewhere. (You may also take Personality Loss normally, in addition to this.)

When these events occur, resolve it via an EGO vs. EGO combat between your true form’s EGO and your target form’s EGO. Whichever one wins trumps the other. The GM may provide bonuses to one side or the other, depending on the situation; this works a lot like Mind Control breakout rolls.

Impersonating someone whose EGO is much higher than yours is generally a bad idea.

IMPERSONATION AMNESIA

Impersonate allows you to know what the target knows while Impersonating them. That means you know the combination to their home safe, the pet names they call their wives, where they went to high school, etc.

However, when you return to your true form you will forget all of that information. This is like a limited form of Multiform Amnesia, but you get no points for it.

At GM discretion, you might remember things that came up explicitly… for example, if you do tell someone where you went to high school, you might remember the answer later. However, this is NOT intended as a substitute for Telepathy or actual interrogation, and trying to use it that way will fail. The point is to keep you from being tripped up by things your target would know.

In particular, any attempt to let yourself be questioned/interrogated/telepathed/etc by your friends so they can note down all the secret things your target knows, or anything that remotely smacks of this sort of thing, will typically result in immediate personality loss (see Personality Loss, above). You have been warned.

Please cooperate with this. If it gets abused too much we’ll eliminate the House Rule.

SUBMERGING PERSONALITIES

You can intentionally “submerge” your own personality under your target’s at any time. It takes a full Turn uninterrupted to do this.

When submerged you become convinced you really are the target, and think and act accordingly. You are unaware of any previous Impersonation.

Surface telepathy will detect the target’s thoughts and not your own, although deep telepathy will reveal the truth.

Submerging gives your target an opportunity to take control (see Personality Loss, above).

You can stay submerged as long as you wish. Your real persona cannot influence your behavior, and in most cases you will be run as an NPC. You remain generally aware of events and can “unsubmerge” at any time.

Unsubmerging takes a full phase, during which you are fully absorbed by the process (same effect as 0-DCV concentration).

“BUILDING” THE TARGET SHEET

Unlike regular Multiform, the character sheet for the target need not be defined or approved ahead of time.

Instead, it is derived automatically from the character sheet of the target when the power is used. Neither the player nor the character has any way of changing the result.

You just copy the target sheet, with the following exceptions:

• Disads. All personality-based Disads (Psychlims, DNPCs, Enraged/Berserks, and Rivalry) from your true form also apply. You won’t get any extra points for these, but they apply anyway. (If it’s ambiguous whether a given Disad is personality-based, it applies.) In some cases this will lead to bizarre conflicts, like “CVK” and “Homicidal maniac”. Usually, just RP it as an internal mental conflict. Have fun with this! But if a crisis arrives, the target’s personality may overwhelm your own (or your own may resurface, if you’ve already lost control). see PERSONALITY LOSS above.
• Foci If a power has a unique Focus, you get the power but not the Focus. (You can get a non-powered simulacrum of it, or not. Character’s choice when the power is used.) In effect you’re in the same position as the target would be if they lost the Focus. (You can, of course, attempt to obtain the Focus from the target.) You get a working copy of non-unique Foci.
• Affects Body Only You can buy “Affects Body Only” (-1/2) on Impersonation. This works just like the equivalent on Shapeshift – you get no Foci, no clothes, etc.

Since Impersonation fails if your target is built on too many points, you’ll always be able to “fit” the target sheet. If you have extra points left over, you get no benefit from them whatsoever.

At GM discretion, you may be allowed a “partial impersonation” if your target is built on too many points – see below for more details.

PARTIAL IMPERSONATION

At GM discretion, you may be allowed a “partial impersonation” if your target is built on more points than your Multiform.

The idea is you end up with a Form that represents a scaled-down version of your target form, without any ability to pick-and-choose. Please note that this is more complicated and can easily bog down play; if a GM rules you can’t do this, it’s probably for that reason. Please be cooperative and pleasant about it.

If the difference between your MP cost and the characters’ CP is small, the GM will pick some powers that you get lower-cost versions of to make up the difference. In general, the result will be an Impersonation with reduced combat capabilities.

If the difference is large, here’s how it works:

1. Copy all Disads from target sheet AND all personality-based Disads (Psychlims, DNPCs, Enraged/Berserks, and Rivalry) from your true form. Handle Disad conflicts as described earlier.
2. Copy other stuff from target sheet until your CP limit is reached. Some notes:
   • Copy in the following order:
     1. CHA, in this order: COM, PRE, INT, EGO, BODY, CON, DEX, STR, PD, ED, END, STUN, REC, SPD.
     2. Skills and talents, in this order: BG skills, languages, talents, other skills. Within each category go in AP order, highest-first; within that go alphabetically.
     3. Perks Again, AP order, highest-first, then alphabetically.
     4. Unframeworked powers RP-cost order, lowest-first, then alphabetically.
     5. Frameworks, in this order: EC, MP, VPP. Frameworks are copied as a whole – you don’t get some EC slots but not others, for example. Yes, you can use a VPP just the same way your target can, God help us all.
   • If you run out of points in your target form partway through a copied item, you get a scaled-down version of that item as follows:
     • Simplest case: fewer APs. For example, given a (60 AP, 30-RP) 12d6 EB when you only have 20 RPs left, you get a (40 AP, 20 RP) 8d6 EB. This works just the same for frameworks – e.g., given a 20-AP EC with three 40-AP powers totaling 80 RP when you only have 40 RP left, you get a 10-AP EC with three scaled-down 20-AP powers.
     • If that doesn’t work (for example, with powers like desolid that don’t scale) apply the following -3 Limitation to the power: “Power doesn’t actually work, just seems to work.” For example, if applied to Desolid, the result would be that you seem to be Desolid to all senses, but you still can’t walk through stuff and attacks still hit you normally. For purposes of simplicity, this Limitation applies to the AP as well as RP. (That way Multipowers can scale neatly.)
     • If that doesn’t work, you simply can’t use the power. You still _have_ it, with that many APs/RPs in it, but it has no effect on anything. (Yes, adjustment powers will work on it, should the situation come up.)

In most cases, you won’t actually have to bother creating this sheet – you’ll be able to determine, roughly, that you have all the skills, languages, and senses of your target, which is usually what matters for impersonation. However, if you end up having to fight a combat in the assumed form, you will probably have to work out the sheet in detail, which may end up slowing down play enormously – especially if you’re using powers with which you as a player are unfamiliar. If that happens, the scene GM may ask you to sit the combat out, or (if necessary) rule that the stress of combat has forced you back into your true form.

Again, please be cooperative and pleasant about this. After all, the point of an Impersonation Multiform is not primarily for combat, but for infiltration.

Comments: Anastrophe

My immediate take on this is that why this might be a good sort of thing to be in the system Rogue-like characters are notoriously difficult to build) the cost you propose is far too low.

For starters, note that a Shapeshift to do something comparable cost in excess of 100 points (Variable's 108-point one isn't even as good (it lacks the Mental Group, which you are including as part of the effects of your 10-point Adder), and Shapeshift gives you none of the Powers, let alone the Skills, of the target! Admittedly (1) Shapeshift lets you turn into things that aren't duplicates of existing entities (although this is a less useful application) and (2) you include some drawback (picking up the personality and disads of the target) - but these are better represent as Side Effects on a power that would have a high Active cost.

Approaching from another angle: the standard way to build this would be to have a VPP from which you could draw any Multiform you like. Obviously house rules on VPPs prevent this (though I think maybe we *could* make an exception on the basis that in a mimic-pool all powers already have a writeup and so are effectively already been approved - I suggest this as an alternative for discussion. The Control cost is that of a Cosmic Power Pool with the appropriate Limitations - something like Limited Class of Powers (Multiforms (-1/2) Has No Choice Regarding How Powers Change (always copies target) (-1/2), SE: Acquires Disads of Target (Minor, Always) (-1/2), SE: Personality May Be Overwhelmed (Sometime, Major) (-1/2). So - including the disad/personality restrictions, this would cost half as much again as the base Multiform, and excluding them 3/8 as much again. And this couldn't be put into another Power Framework.

All this brings me to the conclusion that it this were allowed as a modifier to Multiform directly, the least it should cost is a +1/2 Advantage - and this assumes the listed drawbacks are included. THis would still be cheaper than the VPP build because it could, for instance, go into an EC. My feeling though is that we shouldn't have the drawbacks built in if we were to allow this, because they don't logically have to go together. In which case Mimic-Multiform should be at least a +1 Advantage (and possibly +1 1/2) with the drawbacks taken as Side Effects.

If this seems steep, consider how expensive it would be (and what GM permissions would be needed!) to build something similar *not* using Multiform (which is an easily abused power in 5th edn even before you start putting in in Frameworks). And I would point out that this being an infiltration rather than a combat power does not mean it should be cheap. There are reasons why a good Shapeshift is so expensive (well, it may be a bit overpriced :-)): a perfect disguise is a very dangerous thing (heck, Chrissie's hunted by a Guild world for being able to do nearly-perfect ones).

That's my 2 Quarks. --Stephie 12:53, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

Response to Anastrophe

Thanks for the comments! Some responses:

• First off, please consider my responses here as talking points only… I’m not staff, I’m not offering to become staff at the moment, this is entirely y’all’s decision.
• Re: forcing this into a VPP
  I don’t see any good reason to force characters to buy frameworks.
  Conversely, if they’re going to buy a framework to put their Multiform into, I don’t see any good reason to force it to be a multiform-only framework. For example, it would make enormous sense for someone to throw a shapeshift slot in there, too.
  Relatedly, I don’t see any good reason to prevent them from putting a variable-target Multiform into another framework. Multiform is a Standard power in 5ed revised rules, that means it can go into a framework with other powers.
  (Now, perhaps that’s a balance error in the 5ed rules and we should make Multiform a Special power on CM2, but that’s a whole different discussion and has nothing to do with impersonation.)
• Re: cost
  I have no problem with this being made as expensive as desired. (Since I intend to buy it, I admit I’m biased on the matter, so I’ll refrain from expressing an opinion.)
  That said, I do reject Shapeshift costs as a basis for comparison, for the following reasons:
  • Even today, if I want the ability to turn into a tiger, Multiform is better than Shapeshift in most ways. I actually _become_ a tiger, and therefore am perceived as one by all senses. I have the abilities appropriate to a tiger without having to pay for them in my non-tiger form. Etc.
    Now, perhaps that’s a balance error in the 5ed rules, but if we’re going to try to fix it we should fix it for Multiform and Shapeshift in general, not just in this special case.
    
  • I’m not proposing we try to fix the 5ed rules here, though. What I’m proposing is perfectly doable in a 5ed TT campaign using various “class of form” advantages; the point of the HR is to allow something similar on the MUSH without allowing the abuses on-the-fly variability allow.
    
  • Shapeshift has certain advantages, also. Primarily, that you get to keep all your other powers while in the new form, and you aren’t subject to new Disads (at least, not without choosing to be and getting points for them). It’s also better for cosmetic changes only, which seems to be its purpose. For more fundamental changes, you use Multiform… which, conveniently, is usually cheaper and better.
  • We shouldn’t hose existing characters, of course. If the HR is adopted, I would suggest that any PCs currently doing a Rogue-like deep-impersonate based on Shapeshift be allowed to modify their sheets to use Multiform Impersonate instead.

  That said, I do like your logic of using the VPP control cost as a basis of comparison for the advantage. I haven’t checked your math, but the resulting +1/2 advantage including the drawbacks seems reasonable enough.

• Re: making the drawbacks optional…
  I was trying to find some way to set it up so that it wouldn’t completely derail plots. I’d be nervous running scenes where a character used an undrawnback version, personally… but if y’all agree that it’s fine, I certainly don’t object. (I do think you’re a little nuts, though.)
  Even with the drawbacks, I can see potential problems (hence all of the "please be cooperative" flags).

Mental Illusions version

It occurs to me that a version of this can also be built around Mental Illusions: "make myself look and act like so-and-so."

Major change, I guess. Presumably this is AofE radius (+1) with a huge radius in order to affect all observers, and probably needs to be bought continuous if it's going to be of any long-term use. Self-only (-1/2).

One advantage here is that you can seem to have the target's powers and skills and knowledge (which is useful) without actually having them (which might be abusive and is bound to be complicated). Another is that you fool unique senses.

Probably has to be multiple classes of mind (at least human and computer, given the pervasiveness of electronic sensors).

Of course, as with shapeshift, this is just different. Target's EGO and mental defenses apply, and in most cases you'll need LOTS of dice to reliably hit desired targets... or maybe some kind of wonky cumulative effect ("gee, the more you hang around, the more convinced I am that you're Charlie in some kind of disguise!")? This can be made to work if this is declared by fiat to be a non-offensive power (perhaps require a No Damage Lim) and thus uncapped... still expensive, but buyable.

It also allows for the narratively cool "Hey, wait -- _that_ wasn't Charlie!" realization after the breakout roll is finally made (how much extra would one pay for hearing a mysterious, echoing laugh upon making the breakout roll?).

Oo... even better would be to couple this with Shapeshift. The idea is that you take on the physical appearance, and then you "boost" that with some mental influence to make observers overlook discrepancies (like, for example, the absence of relevant powers). In that case this might even be a Minor Change, and you could possibly get away with not having it be AofE (since observers wouldn't need to be convinced immediately upon entering LoS) or at least keep the radius low (and count on range penalties to keep more distant observers fooled).

Proposed House Rule: Concentration and Movement Powers

The Concentration Limitation, when applied to a Movement power, does not have the "Can't move more than 1"/phase" property described in 5RE. The character can use the full inches of movement purchased with Concentration. If the Concentration-limited Movement power is built to stack on other Movement powers, the "Can't move more than 1"/phase" rule _does_ apply to the other movement. For example, if Ballistic Trajectory Lad buys +20" of Running with Concentration to add to his base 6" running, he can Run at 20" + 1", not 20" + 6". This also applies to NCM and Megascale Movement. That is, if Ballistic Trajectory Lad has x4 NCM on his extra Running, he can run NCM at 80" + 1" = 81".